Comments on: Why The Current Push For Healthcare Is Bad For Everyone http://romeosidvicious.com/2010/03/03/why-the-current-push-for-healthcare-is-bad-for-everyone/ Waking up to cassette tapes and ashtrays all filled up from the night before Wed, 21 Dec 2011 17:41:16 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Romeo Sid Vicious http://romeosidvicious.com/2010/03/03/why-the-current-push-for-healthcare-is-bad-for-everyone/comment-page-1/#comment-294 Romeo Sid Vicious Wed, 03 Mar 2010 23:52:15 +0000 http://romeosidvicious.com/?p=1161#comment-294 We may disagree with what the will of the people is on this but the abuse is what I am concentrating on. The slimeballs, on both sides, in Washington are pushing the public to a point that they have never done before. If they don't back off they will push it hard enough that a third party could come in and cause major issues for both of the existing parties. I actually think that would be a good thing... We may disagree with what the will of the people is on this but the abuse is what I am concentrating on. The slimeballs, on both sides, in Washington are pushing the public to a point that they have never done before. If they don’t back off they will push it hard enough that a third party could come in and cause major issues for both of the existing parties. I actually think that would be a good thing…

]]> By: WhiskeyT http://romeosidvicious.com/2010/03/03/why-the-current-push-for-healthcare-is-bad-for-everyone/comment-page-1/#comment-293 WhiskeyT Wed, 03 Mar 2010 23:49:28 +0000 http://romeosidvicious.com/?p=1161#comment-293 My point on the filibuster thing is that the will of the people could have been enacted (meaning the public option) were it not for the spineless Democrats and filibustering Republicans and "Connecticut for Liberman"s all of which led us here. Basically we are just seeing an ongoing battle of who can abuse the process the most. And yes both parties are guilty as hell. Public option could indeed be enacted here (via "Medicare for All") but the Dems won't do it. Which does go to your point that the will of the people has indeed been unjustly ignored through this entire process. My point on the filibuster thing is that the will of the people could have been enacted (meaning the public option) were it not for the spineless Democrats and filibustering Republicans and “Connecticut for Liberman”s all of which led us here. Basically we are just seeing an ongoing battle of who can abuse the process the most. And yes both parties are guilty as hell.

Public option could indeed be enacted here (via “Medicare for All”) but the Dems won’t do it. Which does go to your point that the will of the people has indeed been unjustly ignored through this entire process.

]]> By: Romeo Sid Vicious http://romeosidvicious.com/2010/03/03/why-the-current-push-for-healthcare-is-bad-for-everyone/comment-page-1/#comment-292 Romeo Sid Vicious Wed, 03 Mar 2010 23:23:05 +0000 http://romeosidvicious.com/?p=1161#comment-292 I was trying to say: All that you mentioned aside that this is not the right move and it will hurt both sides and the public trust. I know they can't rewrite it from the bottom up but the plan Obama has, his plan, is not budget neutral or budget positive and he's trying to push for that to be through reconciliation. The Congressional Budget Office says it's a LOT more than the Senate bill that passed. My point was that no matter where you stand on the issue that this isn't the way to get it done. Yes the public option polls well. I am against it but this time I am not talking about the ins and outs of global health care. I am saying that no matter where you stand this is a bad idea. If you support a public option you can't get it with this process and won't get it later because using this process assures a massive power change. If you don't support it this still emboldens both sides to be idiots later. I honestly didn't mean for this to be about the actual law they are trying to pass but why the method is suicide for a lot of those required for it to work as well as being damaging to the public farther down the road. As well as pointing out that our representatives aren't representing us. And as for the whole "evil filibuster" thing the Dems used it to even block Bush appointees (some of whom I am glad they blocked) which had never been done before. We don't live in a democracy and the founders never intended a 51% percent majority to play football with 49% of the population's teddy bears. That's why the filibuster exists. But the Dems are the ones who made it this easy to implement. They are being bitten by their own party's decisions at this point. They made it a paper hurdle that requires no effort and raised a 2/3 cloture requirement to 3/5. I am all for changing the filibuster process back to requiring speeches to be made on the floor for the whole time the filibuster is on going. I don't think that it's proper that it's, in essence, a gentlemens agreement and little more. But using reconciliation to get around it isn't the way to push anything through. Starting over is the only way a public option will be on the table in the foreseeable future. If they push the current bill through with reconciliation there will be blood in the streets, figuratively, on election day and the chance will be lost for a long time to get a public option into health care. I don't want a public option but if you do then you need to oppose the method that is being pushed right now or you'll never see it. I was trying to say: All that you mentioned aside that this is not the right move and it will hurt both sides and the public trust. I know they can’t rewrite it from the bottom up but the plan Obama has, his plan, is not budget neutral or budget positive and he’s trying to push for that to be through reconciliation. The Congressional Budget Office says it’s a LOT more than the Senate bill that passed.

My point was that no matter where you stand on the issue that this isn’t the way to get it done. Yes the public option polls well. I am against it but this time I am not talking about the ins and outs of global health care. I am saying that no matter where you stand this is a bad idea. If you support a public option you can’t get it with this process and won’t get it later because using this process assures a massive power change. If you don’t support it this still emboldens both sides to be idiots later. I honestly didn’t mean for this to be about the actual law they are trying to pass but why the method is suicide for a lot of those required for it to work as well as being damaging to the public farther down the road. As well as pointing out that our representatives aren’t representing us.

And as for the whole “evil filibuster” thing the Dems used it to even block Bush appointees (some of whom I am glad they blocked) which had never been done before. We don’t live in a democracy and the founders never intended a 51% percent majority to play football with 49% of the population’s teddy bears. That’s why the filibuster exists. But the Dems are the ones who made it this easy to implement. They are being bitten by their own party’s decisions at this point. They made it a paper hurdle that requires no effort and raised a 2/3 cloture requirement to 3/5. I am all for changing the filibuster process back to requiring speeches to be made on the floor for the whole time the filibuster is on going. I don’t think that it’s proper that it’s, in essence, a gentlemens agreement and little more. But using reconciliation to get around it isn’t the way to push anything through.

Starting over is the only way a public option will be on the table in the foreseeable future. If they push the current bill through with reconciliation there will be blood in the streets, figuratively, on election day and the chance will be lost for a long time to get a public option into health care. I don’t want a public option but if you do then you need to oppose the method that is being pushed right now or you’ll never see it.

]]> By: WhiskeyT http://romeosidvicious.com/2010/03/03/why-the-current-push-for-healthcare-is-bad-for-everyone/comment-page-1/#comment-291 WhiskeyT Wed, 03 Mar 2010 23:09:48 +0000 http://romeosidvicious.com/?p=1161#comment-291 You are skipping over the fact that the bill did pass the Senate with a 60 vote super majority. They can't make any changes that aren't deficit neutral or deficit positive. It's not as though they can go in there and completely re-writ legislation from the bottom up. Calling out the democrats for going against the will of the people also ignores that the constant threat of filibuster and holds from Republicans killed any shot of a public option, the part of health care that actually polls better then the current bill. You are skipping over the fact that the bill did pass the Senate with a 60 vote super majority. They can’t make any changes that aren’t deficit neutral or deficit positive. It’s not as though they can go in there and completely re-writ legislation from the bottom up.

Calling out the democrats for going against the will of the people also ignores that the constant threat of filibuster and holds from Republicans killed any shot of a public option, the part of health care that actually polls better then the current bill.

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